An Interview with Keith Ferrazzi

Keith Ferrazzi is the best-selling author of Never Eat Alone: And Other Secrets to Success, One Relationship At A Time. When I worked for Keith in college, I had time to interview him about how building professional relationships, and about how Never Eat Alone can be applied to college life. The interview is two years old (almost to the day) and was first published on my old site. I have reprinted it here as part of my Ask the Writer series. This interview is about college only; writers interested in relationships and Never Eat Alone should follow this link. Although most writers hate to admit it, relationship building is important in finding a publisher. Business plays a key role in writing and in the university. As an instructor, I highly recommend students check out Keith's advice below.

 BP: Are fun and professionalism mutually exclusive? College students have a lot of fun, not necessarily drink or sex, but also simply keeping late hours, watching movies, playing games, and so on. Yet many still manage to maintain solid GPAs and social networks. Can fun and professionalism co-exist at college? Where is the line between excess self-gratification and overwork?

 KF: Having fun and being professionally successful are absolutely not mutually exclusive. The problem is when people get the impression that they have to overdo the fun in college because they won't have a good time once they start full-time jobs after college. And that couldn't be further from the truth. In fact, most of the work I do with organizations is helping their people build stronger personal relationships within the firm, so they work better together, and, frankly, have more fun together at work. We practice what we preach in my firm Ferrazzi Greenlight, too. We're always doing things like touch football, outdoor boot camp workouts, and having parties at my house. Getting to know each other better through fun stuff like that actually adds to our respect for each other as professionals and people.

BP: In college, it seems that many students don't start networking until they reach their senior year: as if college is separated from the rest of life somehow (many people say that leaving college means entering the real world--implying that college is part of a fake world, or that it isn't true life.) Is what they say true? If so, what can college students do to enter the real world long before they are forced to?

KF: If by your senior year you don't already have relationships with working professionals who have mentored you and given you internships, then you won't be "networking." You'll just be job-hunting. If I could only give you one piece of advice it would be this: Build it before you need it. Start during your first year - and if you're past that, then just start now! - getting to know the people who can help you get where you want to go. Too many college students tell me they don't have time to start building these relationships. That's absolute B.S. You don't have time to meet or have a discussion on the phone with one - just one - working professional per month whom you admire, someone you respect and want to be like someday? Of course you can do that. It's all about choices. If you choose to hide behind the veil of "If I get good grades, then I'll get a good job" nonsense, you're job-hunting will be difficult, painful, and unforgiving. And don't use excuses like, "I'll never get a sweet job like Johnny because my dad doesn't own his own company like Johnny's dad does." That's bogus, too. My mom was a cleaning lady and my dad was a steelworker. I wasn't born with a silver spoon. But I chose not to let that hold me back. You can make your own nepotism. You can get access to people who can help you achieve your dreams. But you have to decide to do that and start now. Build it before you need it.

BP: It seems that college students are less likely to behave professionally in social situations, and some are completely disrespectful (come to class unshaven, disheveled, hung-over, or even drunk, attend guest lectures in pajamas, text message each other during tests, watch Lost trailers on their video iPods, etc.) What are your suggestions for impressing upon these students the importance of reconciling their social and academic lives?

KF: That's your call to go to class hung-over and un-showered. Just don't expect to be able to go to your professor when you need a reference letter and her write about how you have your act together. You're missing out if you think you have to disrespect authority to be cool with your peers. You're also not getting it if you think you have to act overly uptight to be cool with professors and industry professionals. There is a balance you can strike where your friends will respect you and older people will also be impressed. Honestly, just look at how most college kids act. You don't have to do much to really stand out as the good egg.

BP: In the last chapter of your book, Never Eat Alone, you write, "Balance is B.S." The chapter deals with the myth of balance between work and private life, and introduces a new theory--that business is human, and that all relationships should be treated as such. Is the same true for college life? How does the theory that work-life balance is a myth relate to academia?

KF: Here's an example. How much do you know about your professor's family? What about her career aspirations and dreams? What does she like to do on the weekends? If you had a personal relationship with her, you'd know things like this, and she'd know these things about you. All it takes is showing up at office hours and besides asking a couple insightful questions about the coursework at hand, mention that you know you can learn a lot from professors just by getting to know them, even aside from the actual coursework. Ask to have lunch. Heck, do your closest buddies a favor and invite them, too, because ten bucks says they wouldn't think to do this. Get to know your professors as people and they'll help you get into grad school or land jobs because they will care about you. And you'll probably learn more in their classes, too. 

BP: In closing, what are your final thoughts on building professional, mutually-beneficial relationships in college? Are there any experiences you have had--either when you were in college at Yale or later experiences with college students who have approached you--that would help to illustrate the importance of relationship building?

KF: Last year, a student from UC San Diego met me at an event for our fraternity, Sigma Chi. We had a brief conversation, and he asked me if I'd talk with him again to give him some career advice. I told him to read my book, Never Eat Alone, and then talk to my assistant to get on my calendar to join me for a workout at Barry's Bootcamp. It took him several months of calling back to get that next meeting to sync up, but we had a good talk then and were in touch intermittently after that. When spring came, he asked me if he could have an internship in my company. We didn't have any spots for paid internships, but he agreed to move to Los Angeles for the summer and work for us without pay. Well, he did good work, actually got me to speak at the World Business Forum, which was awesome, and got to build relationships with everyone in my company over the summer. Guess who we called when a paid position opened up this year? He's been working with us all year part-time and will start full-time when he graduates this summer. And it all started with him seeking help. Most college students are afraid to ask for help, but they just don't get it. There are so many people out there who, like me, are happy to help and want to help others succeed. Many more want to help than don't want to help. Don't be afraid to ask the people who can help you in your career aspirations. The worst anyone can say is No.